I am also dying to learn the answer to this question. Or for that matter, to learn where one gets a grey scrim (doesn't seem like a popular wedding color...). I suspect that white will work (the lighting is very controlled around the fabric) but the it's the size of the weave that is uncertain. Also cotton versus nylon fabric etc.

I posted the question to their website and referenced this post. They have been pretty responsive in the past.

For those that don't know what we are talking about. It's this. Pretty freaking awesome and reason enough to buy this DVD, eh? You just need to control the sight lines so it's hard to see the splash on the surface beyond the fabric in the doorway.

 

A grey-colored scrim could be typical "screen door" screen.
I would think a white scrim would work well, however, if it's a synthetic material like nylon. The material would be more reflective than a natural fiber, so if the projector is on the same side of the scrim as the viewer, it should show up well.
In addition, the synthetic fiber should be a bit more translucent than a natural fiber, so if the projector is on the opposite side of the viewer, hopefully a bit more of the light will show through the fibers, making it a bit brighter.

In a really dark area, black nylon scrim might work well, as long as the projection is on the same side of the scrim as the viewer. The reflectiveness of the fibers will allow the projection to show up quite nicely, and the darkness would hide the black scrim almost completely.

 

Ugly Joe is correct. Go to a hardware store and buy window screening. Regular screen is a little grey as it is and if you want more color they do make a "grey" color that is a darker mesh. Screening will be easier to mount than tulle because tulle stretches and will make your projection waver and wobble. Screening will pull and lay flat. You could nail it to wood or, like another person suggested, go to a Habit for humanity type place and get a storm window screen the size you like. They make all sizes and they are already set up to receive and stretch the screening. I am using screen as a scrim for my project. I am however shining a light on the front of the screen while I sit behind it to operate a puppet.. I can see thru to the audience but they cannot see me. It is cheap stuff. You can buy it by the foot. getting 5 feet of it to test should be a cheap trial.

 

Scrims would typically be used in front- or back-projection scenarios, for which I have no experience. For side-lit projection (see Pepper's Ghost illusion), one could use that window weatherproofing shrinking plastic, put over a frame and shrunk taut (i.e., without wrinkles). Glass is the best, but getting and storing a large pane is problematic.

 

Told you they would reply. Here it is:

"Hello,

We used a grey bridal mesh. You can read the AtmosFX blog post that breaks down supplies and set-up:
http://atmosfearfx.com/blog/entry/creating-the-perfect-materializing-ghost-effect

Cheers,
The AtmosFX Team"

I guess that doesn't tell us much more than you already knew ("grey bridal mesh") because you had seen that blog already. At the risk of being annoying,I will press for more info. Will let you know what I get.

 

Well this is the last communication I got from them:

Hello,

Unfortunately, the blog post has all the information that is available. There was no brand name, weave size, or other info on the fabric. The tag had a generic name - ‘grey bridal mesh’.

We recommend going to your local fabric store with a flashlight to test out which fabrics work best for your display. Shining the light through the back of the fabric is a good indicator of how the effective the fabric will be with a projection.

Cheers,

The AtmosFX Team

 

Well this is the last communication I got from them:

Hello,

Unfortunately, the blog post has all the information that is available. There was no brand name, weave size, or other info on the fabric. The tag had a generic name - ‘grey bridal mesh’.

We recommend going to your local fabric store with a flashlight to test out which fabrics work best for your display. Shining the light through the back of the fabric is a good indicator of how the effective the fabric will be with a projection.

Cheers,

The AtmosFX Team

Doesn’t anybody realize that you can buy the perfect hollusion screen from AtmosFX?!

 

Well, I will be making an attempt using their suggested 'flashlight' method. Thanks for the effort, and for sharing the fruit of your labor, Gus!

I've been looking for a way to bring off a projection effect in the center of the yard without having to go the Pepper's Ghost route. This is the closest thing I've seen to the notion that is in my head.

I don't know that I'll get to it any time soon, but if I find something with a SKU, or other reference number/name, I'll post it right back here....

 

Anyone have any update on this? I tried general grey, white, and black tulle from a local fabric store. They all work somewhat, but are not dense enough. It looks like ~ 35 thread/inch on the images from atmosfearfx. My general tulle is ~ 15-20 threads/inch and the threads are definitely thinner. It CAN work, but in my opinion just isn't bright enough. I've tried doubling them together in a brief test. This works better for the brightness of the ghost, but you have to be VERY meticulous on making sure the 2 layers don't have any gaps between them. It actually gets a bit more 3D ish with a gap, but the ghosts start taking on a wonky appearance and aren't "clean". I'm still looking for a more dense material that is still translucent enough. I'd love to hear more ideas!

 

this effect is very cool.
but I wonder if you need to be concerned with the image showing up on a surface after it passes through the mesh. like on an adjacent wall etc.

still interested in learning of a proven fabric for this application.
please post details if anyone finds a good fabric

 

Yes, you do need to control viewing angles, some of the image WILL pass thru the scrim and land on some object(s) beyond. I still haven't settled on a material yet but it will probably be either white bridal veil material, black veil material, or very small gauge charcoal fiberglass screen like is used for screen doors and windows. I tested each of these through a doorway between rooms in my house. All display a satisfactory image but I need to wait until the weather warms up so I can work outside in the actual conditions I need to deal with and see what looks best.

The way I'll be setting up (hopefully) is in a garage. The layout is such that the front door that faces the street is in a direct line of sight with another door that faces the back yard. My plan is to have the scrim covering the back doorway and project onto it from inside the garage; but at a slight angle so any bleed-through is projected onto some bushes that aren't visible from the front of the house. With a flood light illuminating the back yard and the interior of the garage completely dark I'm hoping a good Pepper's Ghost-type effect will result.

You basically just have to play around and experiment with all the variables that would affect viewing and projecting angles. For instance, maybe you could rear project from a very LOW angle and the bleed-through shows up above and behind the spectators where they can't see it or would have no reason to look. Maybe the bleed-through is visible on a side wall but you position some object between it and the spectators. I don't see this being any more angle-sensitive than the classic Pepper's Ghost illusion, you just have to experiment and find what works for your particular conditions.

 

jco
Agreed, I didnt mean to sound as though the bleed trough would be a deal breaker.
Only that it should expected.
And as you point out. have a plan to mitigate the side effect

 

My application is indoors, and yes I am definitely going to have to deal with the bleed through. My plan was rear projection at an angle much like the video here (where you can see the bleed actually if you look...) and build a slight angle of plastic sheeting out on the right hand wall, which would effetively be the "thing in between" the bleed and the audience. That part I'm not worried about. I'm just concerned about find the "right" material. I'm going back to the fabric store to try some more slightly opaque material (read: thicker or more dense) so I get more light bouncing off. If I find a good candidate, I'll definitely post the a link to the material. If anyone knows links to good material, please post a URL!

Part of me almost wants to just bite the bullet and try www [dot] studio-productions-inc [dot] com /set_home.html with an 8' by 5' finished scrim ~$60. (sorry this is only my second post and the moderators wont let a URL go through until you have 3...sheesh. Anyway, I'll leave it to you to interpret that URL.

Keep the input coming folks!

 

Part of me almost wants to just bite the bullet and try www [dot] studio-productions-inc [dot] com /set_home.html with an 8' by 5' finished scrim ~$60. (sorry this is only my second post and the moderators wont let a URL go through until you have 3...sheesh. Anyway, I'll leave it to you to interpret that URL.

Well, I completely understand your desire to 'bite the bullet' on this particular product. They sure paint a rosy picture of their material. However, I will tell you that I did pull the trigger on this particular bullet, and felt like a complete imbecile when it arrived.

Fair warning, it is literally weed stop. Yes, the stuff you can buy at Home Depot or Lowe's to prevent weeds in your garden. Not even the good stuff. Just the plain ol' $5 a roll weed stop.

Now, I'm not saying it won't work; it does to a degree. However, it doesn't offer any substantively different results than you can achieve with any number of other products (including weed stop), and wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

Luckily, I only purchased a small piece....it really could have been SO much worse. Just my opinion, of course, but I would definitely categorize this as a caveat emptor type scenario.

 

I am also getting close to experimenting with scrim materials. The bummer with the "studio scrim "suggested by Zewyn is what happens if you buy it and the results are disappointing. If I knew the results would be amazing, I would probably splurge (probably good for multiple years). Probably not returnable is my guess.

I was thinking of emailing them, giving them this link, and asking for their recommendation. Did you try that already Zewyn?

 

Very AWESOME now my gears are turning

 

Just a quick search-

http://www.dazian.com/product-detai...ct-details/?sku=Tulle&variantSku=&categoryId=70&subCategoryId=79&catalog=Dazian

 

If you go to your local fabric store and ask for grey tulle (pronounced "tool") and look for one with a hexagonal pattern, that should give you what AtmosFEAR used. Just make sure that the holes in the fabric aren't too big that you can't see through it.

 

Dminor - thanks for the tip but forgive my ignorance - isn't being able to see through it half the point? I want as little evidence as possible that there is ANYTHING there to project on to. I'm ok with losing a little brightness of the projected image, I think that might even make it a bit more realistic in some ways.

 

Nevermind - I just read your post again. Too much fatigue after a long day.....

 

No worries! Actually, now that I'm reading it again, it was written in a confusing manner. Basically I meant to say that you don't want that holes so big that what you're projecting onto it doesn't have anything to be seen against...but also not too small that it's not see through enough for the environment you're using it in.

 

Right....I think that, basically, it comes back to testing in the store with a light source, or taking a leap, and buying some to go home and test with..

I've tried a couple pieces of tulle in store with a flashlight, and haven't been satisfied enough with the results to actually make a purchase. (However, I will note that at the time I was looking for a solution that might work in a near head-on viewing arrangement. I've since decided that wasn't likely to be possible with the hotspotting that was going to be an integral component there.)

Anyway, I guess my point is that the tulle is a very common in-stock item, and simply using a flashlight to illustrate how much light will be 'captured' by the material might help when selecting the right weave/mesh.

 

Ok I've definitely tried black, grey, and white tulle (standard) from Jo-ann Fabrics and also a more opaque, shiny type black, tulle-ish material from Jo-ann as well. I was trying a backlit side angle approach and so far nothing is working great. What I plan to do is to try front side angle and back side angle with each material and then post the results. I've also tried "doubling" up the white and black, but without REALLY trying to make 2 perfect planes with the material, it's hard. I'm still trying here, but I'm really leaning more toward pepper's ghost effect, and then really just use scrim for some overhead ghosts where the look isn't as critical.

 

any luck?



I bought the DVD also. Any luck with material?

 

I really want to purchase the Ghostly Apparitions but think I am going to wait until next year. So sub for information!

 

Consider Dminor's Ghost Maid effect - the Ghost of Rona Marie for $10



To all who don't already know it, and who like Ghostly Apparitions, consider buying Dminor's The Ghost of Rona Marie Ghost Maid projection effect--it's a steal at $10 (digital download). Although I purchased Ghostly Apparitions, I'm not sure I can use it--love several of the loops, except for some of the endings where there's a sudden evil / startle effect. Perfect for those who want it. But I don't do gore, startles, or anything too demonic or scary looking for my yard haunt--lots of small kids. I strive for more of a Disney's Haunted Mansion spooky atmosphere. And Dminor's effect is great for this. Strongly recommend it:

http://www.betterhauntsandgardens.com/efx/ghostmaid.html

A single effect, but a compelling one. Nice to own along with Ghostly Apparitions. To make Ghostly Apparitions usable in my environment, I'd have to edit out some of the end portions of the loops. Dminor, it would be great if you could do a male version of this effect. Something like what AtmosfearFX has done with their Butler-type character. But again, don't know if I care for it because the character removes his head. Too scary for little kids, probably.

 

I bought it to use in my yard but before I ho buying different materials I was wondering if anyone here had luck finding something that works

 

i'm experimenting with stuff i've picked up at walmart ... got a small piece of grey tulle, put it out between two columns in the front porch ... using a piece of crap wonderwall projector ... and its working pretty well ... a better projector will surely yield better results ... but these are supposed to be ghosts that are being projected so i wouldn't want perfect images(?) ... the weave of the tulle is really loose/sparse ... maybe a tighter weave would be better, but then it wouldn't be as transparent, and the effect wouldn't be as good?

i'm thinking about building a "ghost portal" in my graveyard ... making some sort of frame with the tulle material inside ... printing "Ghost Portal" in creepy lettering on the frame ... this way the tulle material won't be as easy to see with the frame border disguising the inevitable contrast between tulle and non tulle areas?

i suggest people pick up a yard or 2 of tulle material at their local fabric or walmart store and start experimenting ... will it be perfect ... probably not, but until someone says "get xyz from abc store" because this is the best stuff for this application, we should do something ...

ok rant over ... sorry about that ... sometimes i get carried away ...

amk

 

Lol its ok. We all get a little carried away sometimes. Your idea sounds awesome! I will definitely pick some up and try it out. Thank you for the ideas!

 

A lot of work was done on this thread

http://www.halloweenforum.com/halloween-props/136888-scrim-help.html

Victor

 

"i'm thinking about building a "ghost portal" in my graveyard ... making some sort of frame with the tulle material inside ... printing "Ghost Portal" in creepy lettering on the frame ... this way the tulle material won't be as easy to see with the frame border disguising the inevitable contrast between tulle and non tulle areas?"

GREAT idea! If you try it, let us know how it worked, love to see some video, too!

 

just got 3 yards of the material from bangcockthaisilks referenced in the link provided by victor above ... i had forgot that i had ordered it ... lol!

i haven't tested it yet, but it looks far superior to the tulle that i got from walmart ... the main difference is that the space between threads is smaller than walmart ... i suspect it will give a better sharper image ...

now, how big should i make my ghost portal? any ideas? i think that the material is 3 x 2 yards, so obviously it'll have to be smaller than that ... and a ghost portal that large would be very unwieldly ...

please, give me your comments on a ghost portal size ...

amk

 

just thought of something ... and my head hurts ... lol!

seriously ... wouldn't an old window frame work as a ghost portal?

amk