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Discussion Starter #1
Hello,
I am building a stirring witch prop like the one here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbwsIYIkPdI. I have a reindeer motor but it's not strong enough to move the head. The head is a mask with a Styrofoam mannequin head inside. any suggestions on a different motor that will mount to the pvc frame and have more torque than the reindeer motor?
Thanks.
 

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Keeper of Spider Hill
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That would likely be the same type of motor that is within your reindeer motor. Do you have a picture of your prop? A reindeer motor should have enough grunt to move a foam head and mask. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I built it just like the one on the video. I will take pics and post them. The mask is from Death Studios, it's pretty heavy. The problem is it has some trouble pushing the head up but also slips as the head comes down so the movement is not smooth at all. I've tried several positions on the frame as well. I think a wiper motor would work better but it's heavy and not easily mounted.
 

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The lower you can mount the motor and the lower you can connect the linkage to the vertical head pipe, the more leverage the motor will have. You may have to give up a little movement to compensate for the weight of the head. You could also try adding a bit of lead weight to the bottom of the vertical pipe as counter weight.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
The lower you can mount the motor and the lower you can connect the linkage to the vertical head pipe, the more leverage the motor will have. You may have to give up a little movement to compensate for the weight of the head. You could also try adding a bit of lead weight to the bottom of the vertical pipe as counter weight.
Makes sense. I have the motor as low as it can go. If I go lower the hurricane clip will hit the cross pipe. I will play with the linkage some more, and try adding a weight. I wonder if I have a defective motor though. I thought if it gets hung up it will reverse direction. Mine just gets stuck and wont reverse. When the head goes down it also seems to slip a bit causing the head to drop quickly. Should it be doing this? I got it from Fright props, it looks a little different than the one Cyclone Jack has in his video.
 

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Try attaching the linkage to the hurricane clip a little closer to the motor shaft. That will yield a little less head movement but will give the motor more leverage.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Try attaching the linkage to the hurricane clip a little closer to the motor shaft. That will yield a little less head movement but will give the motor more leverage.
Okay, I will try that. You don't think there is anything wrong with the motor based on what I've explained.
 

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Okay, I will try that. You don't think there is anything wrong with the motor based on what I've explained.
Well, I'm not sure if your particular motor is supposed to reverse but you don't want that for this prop anyway. As for the head dropping quickly, that's a by product of the head being heavy and the slack within the motor, the linkage, and the head is pulling on the motor because it wants to drop. If you used cotter pins like the video, there's probably some slop in the linkage. Don't get me wrong, you obviously can go with a more powerful motor but I think you can get it working by doing a few things to lessen the force needed to raise the head.
 

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Makes sense. I have the motor as low as it can go. If I go lower the hurricane clip will hit the cross pipe. I will play with the linkage some more, and try adding a weight. I wonder if I have a defective motor though. I thought if it gets hung up it will reverse direction. Mine just gets stuck and wont reverse. When the head goes down it also seems to slip a bit causing the head to drop quickly. Should it be doing this? I got it from Fright props, it looks a little different than the one Cyclone Jack has in his video.
I used to use these motors several years ago and found out quickly they can't handle a lot of weight. Trial and error and i could use them on a few props but I did burn several of them out so i went with wiper motors instead. I actually went in and completely took apart one of the deer motors that wasnt working anymore and found out that all the gears in these motors are plastic. Ended up that several teeth were broke or wore off inside the motor which caused it to hang up and lock between gears. The small plastic gears just dont handle the usage we put them through with Halloween props. With minor adjustments you can get them to work great but it is my experience that after a couple seasons you will have to replace them if there is much torque on your prop and with the falling of the head so quick each little jerk on those gears will break them after time.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Well, I'm not sure if your particular motor is supposed to reverse but you don't want that for this prop anyway. As for the head dropping quickly, that's a by product of the head being heavy and the slack within the motor, the linkage, and the head is pulling on the motor because it wants to drop. If you used cotter pins like the video, there's probably some slop in the linkage. Don't get me wrong, you obviously can go with a more powerful motor but I think you can get it working by doing a few things to lessen the force needed to raise the head.
I actually used screws and nuts instead of cotter pins for that reason. I will try and play with it a little, but may end up needing to get a better motor.
Thanks for all the suggestions.:D
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I used to use these motors several years ago and found out quickly they can't handle a lot of weight. Trial and error and i could use them on a few props but I did burn several of them out so i went with wiper motors instead. I actually went in and completely took apart one of the deer motors that wasnt working anymore and found out that all the gears in these motors are plastic. Ended up that several teeth were broke or wore off inside the motor which caused it to hang up and lock between gears. The small plastic gears just dont handle the usage we put them through with Halloween props. With minor adjustments you can get them to work great but it is my experience that after a couple seasons you will have to replace them if there is much torque on your prop and with the falling of the head so quick each little jerk on those gears will break them after time.
Yeah, I suspect I will need to get a better motor. It does sound like the gears are "grinding." The hard part will be trying to mount that heavy wiper motor to the vertical pvc pipe. They don't seem to have any mounting screw holes.
 

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Can you install one or two springs from the top back of the head to the horizontal pvc collar bones? It will take a bit of trial and error to get the right tension but that may take the load off the motor.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Can you install one or two springs from the top back of the head to the horizontal pvc collar bones? It will take a bit of trial and error to get the right tension but that may take the load off the motor.
I thought of that exact same thing last night. Tried it with a rubber band, because I don't have any springs and it didn't really help but I didn't mess with it that much. I will definitely try everything, because the wiper motors are much more expensive than the reindeer motors. If I do end up using a wiper motor, do have any suggestions on how to mount it to the pvc frame?
 

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You need to either change where the linkage is mounted or add a counter weight. The head is a teeter totter, think of when you are a kid, if you have a big kid and little kid, you put the big kid forward closer to the fulcrum or pivot. The little kid back, farther away from the fulcrum. You need more length at the motor and less at the head. The torque or "pull" of the motor needs to equal the weight of the head. So you can change the length from the fulcrum, or you can add a counter weight to the motor side to compensate. Weigh the head. You need a counter weight near that weight. Just hang something on it. If this doesn't work, your motor is probably shot. The springs that J-Man is suggesting also works the same as a counterweight. It helps your motor with the load. I have been using my deer motor with my creep for years, it is not that big of a strain, you must have a heavy mask on there. Why not try it with just a foam head and add weight to see where it fails?
 

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Discussion Starter #18
You need to either change where the linkage is mounted or add a counter weight. The head is a teeter totter, think of when you are a kid, if you have a big kid and little kid, you put the big kid forward closer to the fulcrum or pivot. The little kid back, farther away from the fulcrum. You need more length at the motor and less at the head. The torque or "pull" of the motor needs to equal the weight of the head. So you can change the length from the fulcrum, or you can add a counter weight to the motor side to compensate. Weigh the head. You need a counter weight near that weight. Just hang something on it. If this doesn't work, your motor is probably shot. The springs that J-Man is suggesting also works the same as a counterweight. It helps your motor with the load. I have been using my deer motor with my creep for years, it is not that big of a strain, you must have a heavy mask on there. Why not try it with just a foam head and add weight to see where it fails?
The motor does run fine with just the Styrofoam head, but it's not as smooth as I would like. I will try to even out the weight of the head with the back pipe where the linkage is. The mask is the Swamp Witch from Death Studios.
 

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I thought of that exact same thing last night. Tried it with a rubber band, because I don't have any springs and it didn't really help but I didn't mess with it that much. I will definitely try everything, because the wiper motors are much more expensive than the reindeer motors. If I do end up using a wiper motor, do have any suggestions on how to mount it to the pvc frame?
Yeah, a rubber band ain't gonna do much, you need a decent spring (or 2). The nice thing about using springs is that it doesn't add any weight to the prop, that pvc frame can only take so much.
 

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Yeah, a rubber band ain't gonna do much, you need a decent spring (or 2). The nice thing about using springs is that it doesn't add any weight to the prop, that pvc frame can only take so much.
bungee cord would work
 
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