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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #1
I want to build a centerpiece for my town square and I was thinking of building a fountain -- but I don't want to use water. I was hoping to make a fountain that uses creeping ground fog. What I don't know is how I should produce the fog.

One method might be to build a fog chiller into the center of the fountain and use a 400w fogger to produce ground fog. My concern is that I haven't had any success building fog chillers in the past.

Another option might be to use a bucket of heated water and dry ice. In this case, I would need to rig a fan (or series of small fans) to help carry the ground fog up the shaft of the fountain and out the top so that it may cascade down the exterior. My concern here is that if I use fans to push the fog up and out the top of the fountain, it my disrupt the fog too much and it won't cascade down the exterior like I want.

Please, any and all thoughts are welcome. :)

This is a graphic I found online of the style of fountain I want to build. Of course, I would decorate with many a ghoulish element. The version I hope to build will stand about six feet tall.

 

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tk those fountain foggers are cool, but they dont put out the amount of fog your prob looking for . its a very small amount i have a couple of them . they are cool..... just not enough output
 

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you might have to treat each level as a separate fountain with three fog machines total. then you could use flexible ducting with holes on the side to bend the fog around the basins. cover the ducting with ice and should chill the fog enough. try it with one machine to see if you like the effect then work your way up. I definitely think this is a great idea but will be difficult to use the same fog from the top to travel all the way out the bottom basin. let us know how you finish this prop, as this seems like a very cool effect.
 

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You will be constantly replacing dry Ice. Your best bet is to build the fog chiller and run pvc pipes to the different level. That would give you a constant fog falling off the tiers. You could provably buy a fog chiller for the cost of a good pond fogger. just don't get the little ones. Make sure you get one that has a cooler or fridge on it. Also get a gallon of Foggies Juice.
 

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Hi TK, when I think about using dry ice for an effect my next thought is always how am I going to replace it throughout the night. It provides a nice effect but can be a pain in replacing it all the time to keep the effect how you want it.

I just read Brushe's comment and he writes exactly what I was going to...run PVC up the tiers sothe fog rolls down. How to get it to roll down is the effect you want help with and I think that is the best option if the fountain is going to be in the same design as the picture. Before I put my fog machine & chiller away last year I experimented with running pvc slightly underground (a few inches), filled around it with ice, and covered that with grass clippings and dead leaves which gave me fog creeping out of the ground. I mention that because the effect you want is fog to roll down the columns and it will be all about chilling the fog. I think if you use a cooler as a chiller (mine is a 48 Qt cooler) hidden a short distance away, run pvc from that in a channel underground and packed with ice to cool it and keep it cool the entire way then up through the fountain, then you would have cold fog rolling out the top.

Sounds like an awesome prop, let us know how you design it and send a pic along.
 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #7
You will be constantly replacing dry Ice. Your best bet is to build the fog chiller and run pvc pipes to the different level. That would give you a constant fog falling off the tiers. You could provably buy a fog chiller for the cost of a good pond fogger. just don't get the little ones. Make sure you get one that has a cooler or fridge on it. Also get a gallon of Foggies Juice.
I ust received a gallon of swamp juice last week. So I'm ahead of you on that. :D

Thanks for the suggestions.
 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #8
Okay, so after reading all of your comments, I am still torn. Because I have had poor success with homemade fog chillers, I was thinking of trying something else. I also don't like the on - off - on - off routine of a timed fogger.

If I did go the fogger route, I could use the PVC pipe and fill each tear of the fountain with ice. The fog could come up through the bottom of tier, run through the ice, and then - hopefully - gently cascade down the exterior.

If I go with the mister route, I can put a heavy duty mister in each tier of the fountain. I like this idea because the misters are low-maintenance and continuous. Another plus for the misters is they often come with LEDs which would further enhance the look of the fountain. The problem is they're expensive. Really expensive.

The dry ice is still a contender because of it's simplicity. If I get a heating coil for each tier, then plunk in dry ice, the hot water should keep the reaction going for a while, maybe 20-30 minutes per 1/2 pound of dry ice. I know I would need to refill throughout the evening, but it has the merit of being painfully simple.

Like I said, I'm still undecided. I think I need to build and test some concepts first.
 

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I agree, do your testing. My thoughts are that you will be refilling your dry ice all night long and taking away from the effect and folks/ToT's will see you running back & forth.

I never used a mister but see that they are expensive. Will folks get close to the fountain to see the mist they put out though? With the little misters I've seen the fog seems to stays in the pot or cauldron, not sure about the big ones.

The only problem I see with the ice on each tier is that I do not think that will give the fog enough time to chill and cascade down and it could take away from the effect if folks can look in the fountain and see the ice.

I haven't tried this in practice yet but I did make a dual pipe into my fog chiller so that I can have 2 fog machine on alternating times pumping out fog. I think it would make me refill the cooler once during the night but could be an option if you have 2 of them.

Do you have a pic of your chiller? Inside it too? Let's see if we can figure out why the chilled fog hasn't been good.
 

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Sounds like a cool project. What i am curious to know is if your fog can be pushed up that high with a couple different exit points. Still new to fog so will be watching this. What I can agree on is that I would deffinatley test your system out before spending all that time getting the pipe inside the fountain.
 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #11
I agree, do your testing. My thoughts are that you will be refilling your dry ice all night long and taking away from the effect and folks/ToT's will see you running back & forth.

I never used a mister but see that they are expensive. Will folks get close to the fountain to see the mist they put out though? With the little misters I've seen the fog seems to stays in the pot or cauldron, not sure about the big ones.

The only problem I see with the ice on each tier is that I do not think that will give the fog enough time to chill and cascade down and it could take away from the effect if folks can look in the fountain and see the ice.

I haven't tried this in practice yet but I did make a dual pipe into my fog chiller so that I can have 2 fog machine on alternating times pumping out fog. I think it would make me refill the cooler once during the night but could be an option if you have 2 of them.

Do you have a pic of your chiller? Inside it too? Let's see if we can figure out why the chilled fog hasn't been good.
I threw away my poor excuse for a chiller from last year -- it was terrible and didn't do a damned thing. So I am really starting this project from scratch. Right now, it's just an idea in my head -- nothing more. I don't even know if I could build something that would work. :confused:

I am going to take today to get some other projects out of the way so that I can focus on the fountain plans.
 

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what about a more "direct" approach...if you have the top tier large enough, and it wouldn't have to be that big, you could just put a ground fogger machine in it, perhaps even filled with ice...also, maybe fill all of the tiers with ice to provide more cold for the fog as it falls. this is going to be a real trial and error project, but could be really beautiful when it works...go for it!
 

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Gotta agree with markgoodson. If you use dry ice, you'll be refilling it the whole event.

Some may say the ultrasonic mist makers are expensive (usually around $25 each), but if you calculate the time and money you'll spend dealing with dry ice, I think you'll agree with going the mister route. Plus, you'll not have to deal with the on/off routine of dealing with a chiller fogger.

I just found Artistic Delights on the net with a sale on mist makers: $19.95 ea. or 5 for $95. If you went this route, I'm thinking you'll need a total of six - 3 on the lowest level, 2 on the center and 1 at the top. So you'll be talking about $115 for misters.

As an alternative, they also sell a 5-Disk Pond Fogger for $110.



From their website:

Great for Halloween Cauldrons! If you don't want the water to spray outside of the container, use a container that is at least 18 inches in diameter. Fog will roll out but not spray.

The unit is lighter in weight than 5 separate Mister/foggers and only needs one wall outlet. These units will fill a 5 foot area respectively. Our 5 disk mister is for indoor and outdoor fountains and ponds.

A floating rubber buoy holds the mister only and is included for free. Mister unit is 110 volt, 6 cycle.

Rate of Diffusion:
5 Disk Mister diffuses 500 ml of water/hour
Maybe one of these would work at the very top (depending on the size of your prop) and just billow the mist all the way down. I'm sure Artistic Delights would be up for answering questions if you contacted them.
 

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The Hobo Spider Assassin
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Gotta agree with markgoodson. If you use dry ice, you'll be refilling it the whole event.

Some may say the ultrasonic mist makers are expensive (usually around $25 each), but if you calculate the time and money you'll spend dealing with dry ice, I think you'll agree with going the mister route. Plus, you'll not have to deal with the on/off routine of dealing with a chiller fogger.

I just found Artistic Delights on the net with a sale on mist makers: $19.95 ea. or 5 for $95. If you went this route, I'm thinking you'll need a total of six - 3 on the lowest level, 2 on the center and 1 at the top. So you'll be talking about $115 for misters.

As an alternative, they also sell a 5-Disk Pond Fogger for $110.



From their website:



Maybe one of these would work at the very top (depending on the size of your prop) and just billow the mist all the way down. I'm sure Artistic Delights would be up for answering questions if you contacted them.
This was featured on DIY and HGTV, seems to be the best option for a long term investment. unless of course your planning on changing your theme next year TK!
 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #15
The idea of a big mister, or several little misters, is a good one. I just hate spending the money to see if it will work. My worry with using the ultrasonic misters is the weight of the fog. Even in the slightest breeze, the fog could completely dissipate.

Who knows, maybe this is just too grand an undertaking?

Please keep those ideas coming!!


 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #16
I have found a big 9 head mister on eBay that's not too bad a price. But as I said, I don't know if the mist/fog would be heavy enough to cascade down the way I see it in my mind.
 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #17
JA, you make a good point!! If I'm going to keep the fountain and use it over multiple years, it makes sense in invest in a good fogger or ultrasonic mister.
 

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Pirate of the Puget Sound
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I like the idea of a multi-tiered fog fountain, but if it's outside, the wind is likely going to ruin the effect.

What about a simpler fountain that has a large base for either a fog chiller (or ultrasonic mister) and deep enough to contain the fog, and an element that spews recycled water into the "fountain" via a pump.
Something like this one but on a larger scale.
I can see this fitting into your towne theme.


Mountain Fairies - Gargoyle Water Fountain
 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #19
Litemareb4xmas was smart enough to suggest I build the fountain from Nightmare Before Christmas. This is a wonderfully artistic fountain that would fit the theme and be simple to make (in theory) by putting a mister in the reservoir and a pond water pump to pump water up to the mouth to fall back into the fountain.

 

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Mill Creek Haunted Hollow
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Discussion Starter #20
I'm thinking wood basin, PVC body, chicken wire, and lots of monster mud. :D

I'll need to put a black pond liner in the basin.
 
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