Thread: What to use as a trigger.

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I've started on a new pneumatic prop this week. Video of it below. I've gotten most of the mechanics worked out. I need some help on the electronics though.

This is my biggest project so far. I have a pop up trash can prop that I activate using an X10 controller. All that needs to come on with it is the solenoid and a light. On my new prop I would like to add sound. I've been looking at simple controllers and most likely will get either the "PicoBoo" or the "Nerve Center" controller. Any input on the comparison of the two would be greatly appreciated.

My main concern is triggering the prop. I like my trash can because I can be anywhere in the yard with my remote and trigger it. I don't want a motion or pressure mat sensor because we will usually have kids lining up and I don't want it to go off every second ruining the surprise. I also don't want to have to be near the prop to trigger it with a wired in button.

Fright Props has a remote trigger for $140.00 that will trigger up to 4 devices. The problem is, if I am understanding it correctly, they all have to be wired into the trigger. Meaning that any all of your remote controlled props would have to be pretty near to each other or otherwise have wires running all over the yard.

I think I would be ok paying that much for the remote trigger if I knew I could eventually control 4 props all over the yard. But, $140 is a little steep for me knowing that I'm limited to controlling only props that are right next to each other.

Is there another alternative I could use? I do like the X10 and was wondering if there was a way hack in to it and use it as the trigger. Any ideas would be appreciated. I don't really know much about electronics but I figured I need to start learning if I'm going to keep expanding my haunt. Thanks.

YouTube - Halloween prop scissors

That has a long extension. I hope that is going to be a distance away from the ToTs. Might want to check Hauntproject.com. HauntProject.com - Your visual source for Haunting How-To's

How's your soldering skills? I posted a two-stage prop controller circuit in this thread:

Radio Shack Talking Pumpkin Insert

You can use a Parallax PIR sensor in place of the Pumpkin Insert, but add about $10 to the cost. As designed, the controller has a max "off" time of ~55 secs. You can change this by increasing the value of the "off" time potentiometer.

Why not just use another channel on your x10 system? I've got x10 remotes that control up to 8 channels wirelessly.

If your concern is triggering the sound *with* your prop, a simple 110v relay would give you the dry contacts you need to hack into an mp3 player or other sound device.

Craig

I would like to use the X10. I'm just not sure on how to hack an mp3 player or sound device. Would the mp3 player be able to immediately start sound as soon as it has power?

You could do as I have done in the past . When I want to trigger a prop when I want it triggered , and not some sensor tells it to .

use a cheapo remote for car alarms , or car door openers or car starters.


They can be had for as cheap as $20.00 for both the transmitter and the receiver and usually are good for 4 channels . ( of course , each channel is triggered separately as you click the button the transmitter you have assigned to it )

And since the majority of the cheaper ones uses mechanical relays , then different voltages , is not a problem. And if the relay is not strong enough ( amperage wise ) then replace it with one that is . ( they , also are cheap )

Originally Posted by matthewthemanparker

I would like to use the X10. I'm just not sure on how to hack an mp3 player or sound device. Would the mp3 player be able to immediately start sound as soon as it has power?

Depending upon type and how you set it up, most mp3 players will play the "next" song when you press "play". If you have only one song, it'll play it to the end of that song, and, unless you've put "repeat" on, stop and wait for you to press "play" again.

So, basically, the hack here is to put a 110v relay on the output of your x10 appliance module (not a "soft start lamp module"), and hook the normally open contacts of the relay to the "play" contacts on the mp3 player. When you hit the remote, it will trigger the appliance module, turning on your prop and the relay, which will cause the mp3 player to play the first song. You'll want to hit the "off" button on the x10 remote before the song completes, otherwise your mp3 player may repeat the song. The way to defeat that is to put a long period of silence on the end of your song, so you'll have plenty of time to hit off.

Craig

I don't know much about electronics/relays so this may sound like a stupid question. When the relay is triggered, will it be sending 110V through the mp3 player? Or, is the 110V just used to activate the relay separate from the circuit you are trying to complete? If this is the case, I should be able to use the relay/X10 to act as the "trigger" on the controller. I originally thought this but didn't want to risk frying the controller with 110V.

Originally Posted by matthewthemanparker

I don't know much about electronics/relays so this may sound like a stupid question. When the relay is triggered, will it be sending 110V through the mp3 player? Or, is the 110V just used to activate the relay separate from the circuit you are trying to complete? If this is the case, I should be able to use the relay/X10 to act as the "trigger" on the controller. I originally thought this but didn't want to risk frying the controller with 110V.

The 110v goes from the appliance module to the relay coil contacts. The relay clicks on when it gets 110v, thereby completing the circuit between its "common" and "normally open" poles. There will be no voltage across those two poles. That's what's called a "dry contact". So, it won't interfere with the whatever it is connected to.

You could use it to trigger an external computerized controller, or, for a simple prop (like a trashcan with a scream audio track), you can use it to directly trigger the prop itself. For example, if the sequence of events is:
1. trigger
2. turn on 110v to prop
3. wait 1/2 a second
4. make sound
5. wait a few seconds
6. turn off 110v to prop

You could do this without a computerized controller by piggybacking the prop and relay on one x10 appliance module. One connection goes to the prop. The second, in parallel, goes to the relay. You'd set up your sound with a 1/2 second block of silence at the beginning, then the sound, then more silence. When you press the remote, the prop would trigger, as would the silent 1/2 second of sound, followed by the real sound, then the silence. When you've heard enough silence, you hit the off button on the remote.

If you wanted to be super creative, you could set the mp3 player to choose a random track. You'd set up multiple sound tracks, all configured basically the same but with, for example, different screams, and put them into the player. When you hit play, the mp3 player will choose one. That would give you some variability to trigger a scare more than once to the same party.

Craig

Thanks for your input Craig. I have one more question. I found an old mp3 player I had and took it apart. I soldered two wires to the play contacts. But, it does not start playing the file until after I connect and then disconnect them. Meaning it would not play the file until after I cut power to the relay. It would work if when I turned on the X10, the relay would break its circuit instead of completing. Are there relays that work opposite?